For your six cylinder Merc lovers, be sure to attend Mark & Elaine Suter's AOMCI swap meet October 20 where you'll see the completed 666. A series of pics will be posted here as the project develops. Enjoy!
Tim
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For your six cylinder Merc lovers, be sure to attend Mark & Elaine Suter's AOMCI swap meet October 20 where you'll see the completed 666. A series of pics will be posted here as the project develops. Enjoy!
Tim
Hi Tim,
Thanks for posting the latest project. Should be a fun engine. Is it starting with a60 or 66 cubic inch engine? Seem to recal that someone had built one with 9 carbs way back in time.
Alan
6 cylinder, 6 carbs, 6.... ?
Looks awesome so far!
Hi Alan,
Even though it's not legal for racing, the "666" is based a "Super Marathon' because pistons are readily available - big brother to the "444". It will have Parker stacks and Speedmaster, mounted on one of my (very short) steel towers. Hopefully you'll be able to see it at Suter's. More pics.
Tim
Hi Tim, won't be able to attend Mark's AOMC meet, so, please post pictures. From what I understand, Mark's collection is now having space problems. Spoke to Mark at the racers reunion at DePue a couple of weeks ago. Sure miss the MI days. It was great seeing Mark and the Harrison engines he brought. Even met Kay Harrison.
Keep those ideas coming. :)
For Alan and Al,
You betcha, images will be posted after the meet. For now, will post construction images as it progresses.
About the 9-carb six: This was an F-alky owned/raced(?) by Joe Michelini at one time; not sure who built it. Pretty sure there are images in this site in the "random shots from the pits" section. Very complicated looking. Unfortunately, there are no reports on how it worked. Perhaps a reader who knows will respond: Gene East or Bruce Summers?
Given the very tall Speedmaster, this "all-Mercury" engine (Doug Kay's suggestion) is sized for my Ropp hydro for a few fun runs - gotta hear that sweet Merc six sound, and wake up the neighbors every now and again!
Tim
Found this in the Mercury 40-H thread.
Alan
I've never read anywhere about carb inlet location versus crank angle
I wonder if and how much difference that makes
Note sure if there is any difference about carb angle to the crank, except that straight-in is best. Unfortunately, Tillotsons are tall so there's no way to stack them. About 22 degrees offset each way (total 44) is the minimum splay for clearance between carb bodies (appx 1/16"). Interestingly the 444 uses factory couplers, as will the 666.
The 444 set lowest ET at IOA Hillsdale, it's first race with Rich Welch driving. It now resides in the Mark Suter collection. See "Outboard History - Name that Outboard" section on this site for detail. I'm hoping the 666 will deliver another order of magnitude better. It will be interesting to see how it "stacks up" against my loop triple OMC's.
Tim
Very nice Tim. Will enjoy hearing it run. Maybe we could run it with the 75-H mod engine.
Alan
Great idea - let's do it! Next year we will get Rich's six as well (perhaps others - Sam?), the sound of multiple six stackers on the course would be fantastic. Perhaps at the AOMCI Constantine meet? One thing for sure: We need a top quality videographer to record the views and sweeeeet music!
Tim
Count me in. If we could get 6 or so on the course it would be a thing to see.
Alan
I have 4 cabovers that I am trying to get on the water at the same time. I will be at Constantine next year.
More today, lots more this weekend!
Tim
Here, the adapter castings are assembled with the crankcase and roug bored through.
Tim
Here the roughed in crankcase is shown with the block. Much work to go.
Tim
Am I the only one who's loving this series of photos!
Jeff
PS: Interesting that TIm bolts the reed holders to the block where the old carbs bolted on. I did it the same way with my El Crude-Oh setups. Any other similarity ends there!
Tim it is looking great. As you know Doug used your castings for the exhaust of the 75-H he built. If you need any info on that your welcome to run over and take some measurements. I have some photos also if you would like them. He water cooled the filler block.
Alan
Hey Jeff,
Your observation about the carb flange mounting is instructive for those that may want to build similar mods. Note that the diagonal ribs remain untouched - they are needed to support the crankshaft thrust loads. Also, they are convenient hard points. The only other attachment option is the crankcase flange, which would require a complicated, difficult to machine, and heavier bridge casting.
Tim
Would be legal in Pro on a runabout (1100 CCR) Would love to see it entered at the nationals.....Bob
Another great opportunity to hear that sweet sound (& smell). What engines are commonly run in 1100 runabout? Is the class run in the midwest?
A little more 666 progress....
Tim
In the 1100 Runabout class they mostly run Konig or Koney 700 cc engines, maybe a few 800+ engines and a VRP or Rossi. There is a Merc 6 cylinder run of Alky which can beat the Konigs. I believe it is a 66 ci. out of Calif. If your 666 isset up it should be competitive. The class is run in Constantine, Mich. and at the Pro Nationals. Too bad there are not more races for this class, It is a real crowd pleasure. ....Bob N-96
Nice project Tim
Isnt the crankcase compression ratio going to be quite a bit lower or is there more clever stuff to come?
good luck
Powerabout
Unfortunately, the "666" is not legal for 850cc Mod because it's 66 cubic inches (Mark 78), and has 6 carbs (the Mark 75 - 60 cubic inch engine is legal with 3 carbs). Even though it's 66 cubic inches and has a much better breathing intake system, it's still a deflector, and heavier than the 49.9 OMC. Might be close.........
Tim
Can be made lighter ... I'm certain :D
Good question - you betcha there's more coming. The intake casting and reed plate locate pyramid reed block apex within .060" of the rod swing. More importantly, the reed cages are padded top and bottom with .250" thick plates This makes up for some/much of the duct increase.
The 444 project proved dramatic breathing improvement which is expected to benefit the 666 likewise. Though not legal for Mod, I'm building the beast just so I can hear that sweet music and rattle the neighbors occasionally.
That it can be run in 1100cc PRO is a pleasant, unexpected benefit. Might spike the avgas with methanol, not sure if it will ever see pure alky. But, you never know!
Tim
PS Here the duct castings are trimmed to match the carb adapters.
Rest assured Sam, I'll make every effort to reduce weight. But the engine will be equipped with a Merc Speedmaster which is no lightweight even after bobbing 5" off the tail. Though the very tall case reduces weight of the tower, it will be in the 45# range combined. Ad a 120#-ish fully dressed powerhead and you get 165-170#.
So it will just have to make brute power to compete. Assuming 2 HP / Cubic Inch at the crank can be achieved (on gasoline & oil), we're looking at 120 HP at the propshaft. Not shabby, but I'm guessing the Koenig, VRP, Rossi, etc. make similar numbers at much less weight. Throw in some alky though.......
Stated before, I'm building this out of a great appreciation for that Mercury six cylinder shriek - six pulses per revolution - like an F1 car at full tilt boogie!
Tim
Hi Bob,
Jimmy Robb says the class is 2-person runabout, which sounds like fun to me. Was planning on building a big runabout for Top-O this winter that might also work for 1100cc runabout. But, I'll need some help with boat specs. Can you send the basics and post some pics? That would be very helpful.
Tim
Tim, I sure would like to know how the heck you got into all this? I mean where did you earn to modify all these engines, trial and error??
Rebuilding blown up Merc "green top" twins for a Mini-Max built in my youth, I scrounged local marine dealers for parts annually. As a result, my first real job became apprentice mechanic at Fairlane Boats & Motors in Detroit, a Kiekhaefer Mercury dealer that stocked parts for and serviced all racing outboards. Frequented by local racers, the place became known as "home of the clamp-on kids" under the direction of master mechanic John Carlsen.
Two years later, legendary engine builder Bud Parker cogratulated me for perfect 25SSH starts at Ocoee, an act that began a new path in life. Though he built many stocks, Bud's heart was in Mod and Alky: In 1975 he talked me into a 25Mod. In 1988, I went to the big boats running D, E, and Formula-E Mod, learning machining & pattern making working at Bud's shop evenings and weekends for 10 years to support the habit.
Bud retired after 55 years engine building in 1998, whereupon I acquired his machine tools, jigs, fixures, patterns, and have been building Mods, a few stocks, and even two of Bud's own alky loopers ever since. In total, I've been swinging marine wrenches and machine handles for 40 years - yikes!
Yes, there was a lot of trial and error. A substantial "box-o-shame" was generated in the process. Over the years I've come to know many fine racers, enthusiasts, and mentors that inspired my work. The 666 photo series is a gift for all to see the inner workings, an inspiration for the next generation of engine builders. With the machine tools and information available today by the web: If you can dream it, you can build it!
Tim
Are you planning on running an overdrive like Lon Stevens did?
Tim