Butts Aerowing-The Only Way To Fly

[smittythewelder]

Hal Kelly's Ben Hur was a distinct design, but there was a scaled up Jupiter developed by an old-timer some here will remember named Dub Parker. Kelly drew a set of plans for this larger Jupiter, but I never saw a boat built from them. If the bottom angles were got right, this could have been a very good boat for the time.

Hal Kelly did get a lot of us started in racing. I have often wondered whether Nick Marchetti got his start with a Wetback, because his early A and B Stock hydros are very close to being Wetbacks without the hook in the bottom. If you fix the bottom of a Wetback (and put a sponson fin on it), as I did once, it works as well as a Marchetti. I have also wondered whether Sid-Craft's runabouts of the early '60s owed something to Kelly's late-'50s Foo-Ling and Madcap runabouts, which were his best designs.

If I had an avatar, John, it would have to show me making a bad start.

[John (Taylor) Gabrowski]

There was a resized Hal Kelly - Jupiter here in D and everyone assumed it was a variant of the Hall Kelly - Ben Hur. It was that Hal Kelly look. Many of the other boats designs and thoughts were exactly yours in date era and time here to in those comparissons. I had a "Wetcback" here that was a D sized, made from marine grade fir plywood, without that bottom hook and went from a center fin to a sponson fin and it handled quite well as you say one probably would. The owner builder was going to make a mahogany version of it as a result but was killed in an auto accident a short time later, so that never happened and no one else went that direction either.

[Master Oil Racing Team]

...Dubinski's. With all this talk of the S bottoms, I was thinking about the Dubinski the last couple of days. I don't know if there was an S, but it seems like there was a rocker bottom that would ensure that the sponsons were off the water. In 1967 we started running C and later D classes. My Dad found a racer in North Carolina that was getting out and we bought his trailer, several Konigs and it came with 3 Dubinski's. I don't know what happened to those hydros. Never ran one. There must be some photos out there of Dubinski hydros.

[John (Taylor) Gabrowski]

The making of the avatar was a freebe done for me by a board administrator as a kind favor. Smitty! You too can have one. I can't seem to take the time to do something for me that often, so I accepted the offer garciously to the provider. Thanks Jeff!! again

[Dr. Thunder]

What exactly is the diference between a "rocker" and a
S". Can someone draw me a picture of how the bottoms would be different?

[John (Taylor) Gabrowski]

In very simple terms a rocker is a bottom that is like a bow (as in bow and arrow)with the bow down and its tips up. Causes the front end of a racing runabout to go up and down as in power and grab, loss of bite and repeat. The raceboat rocks bow up and than down, sometimes gently sometimes violently which is also speed and power dependent. Some runabouts rock until the higher end is achieved and the bow no longer rocks, raceboat runs flat.

A Hook is the reverse of the bow where the backend dops down from the normal level curvature designed into the bottom. Hooks nail the front down and create a uneven ventilation on the bottom of the runabout because the bottom at the stern drops down as opposed to a rocker where the planing surface of the stern is upturned.

When a racer prepares his bottom the idea is the elimination in general terms of hooks and rockers to give those last inches a smooth slide to the edge of the bottom that normally be a 90 degree sharp corner from the bottom edge upward.

To me that rocker and its need for elimation was what was wrong with by Banshee VI racing runabout (Banshee racing runabouts here were built by E.J. Ted Coates a local racer from my area). Later the idea of adding fiberglass and mat on the last sections of bottom to take the rocker out at the stern area proved to be too heavy, too difficult with fiberglass separations from wood always being the problem so that last section of bottom was ripped out, frames slightly lined to bring them down within the farmes line up done again but with a real gradual hook built in and sanding ajusted to lay the bow down at the highest speeds to keep her from/eliminating rocking. Largely that was successful but still not as good a raceboat as her predecessor, Banshee V.

I have seen some neat ideas used to change or deal with rockers or hooks that involved very heavy weights and waiting all winter for their eduated guess of weights and the time it would take to gradually pull to get the job done. That is why I choose to rip that section of bottom out and do it over.

I wonder if there are any drawings left around or pictures in some wood boat building magazines somewhere to help you?????

[John (Taylor) Gabrowski]

The "S" as applied to say a Hal Kelly Jupiter B Stock hydro from way back when 60s is as if you introduced a bottom that goes straigght from the bow and then hooks down somewhere in the last third of the hydros bottom that then continues on to the stern. The air traps that come off the rear of the sponsons serve to enclose the air bubble from the sides right past the bottoms S to keep that bubble from venting out the sides and streaming to the rear transom bottom area to lift the whole hull including hopemfully the sponsons to get the least wetted area possible to air out the bottom to where the prop and gearcase would ride near surfaced. An ideal 3 point hydros stance when the hull is lifted free as aired out getting maximum accelleration and speed as a result of being free from wetted surfaces.

Anyone??

[John Schubert T*A*R*T]

[QUOTE=smittythewelder]Hal Kelly's Ben Hur was a distinct design, but there was a scaled up Jupiter developed by an old-timer some here will remember named Dub Parker. Kelly drew a set of plans for this larger Jupiter, but I never saw a boat built from them. If the bottom angles were got right, this could have been a very good boat for the time.

Hal Kelly did get a lot of us started in racing. I have often wondered whether Nick Marchetti got his start with a Wetback, because his early A and B Stock hydros are very close to being Wetbacks without the hook in the bottom. If you fix the bottom of a Wetback (and put a sponson fin on it), as I did once, it works as well as a Marchetti. I have also wondered whether Sid-Craft's runabouts of the early '60s owed something to Kelly's late-'50s Foo-Ling and Madcap runabouts, which were his best designs.

If I had an avatar, John, it would have to show me making a bad start.

Just the opposite as the first Sid runabout was built in the late 40's. Hal Kelly's first boat was built either in 1953 or 1954 and was copied from a Sid. Many times on our way home from races, especially when Johnny Wehrle ran the 1st Hornet after getting beat at Devil's Lake with the Sid bathtubs in A & B. The nationals in Devils Lake were in August. I guess Sid was designing the boat during the long trip back to NJ with Johnny & in a week he built it. Johnny raced in A & B runabout at Lock Haven & I think he won both. On the way home my dad, brother, the Wehrle's & the Kelly's stopped at a diner for dinner. Johnny's dad, Wiff, said "where is Kelly"? Found him outside measuring the new Hornet. Nevertheless, Hal was a great designer working for Fawcett publications who published his plans and kind of sponsored his racing. They were also the people that sold the "Paint a player by number" kits. Hal advcertised these kits on the side of his trailer. See picture below

[John Schubert T*A*R*T]

[QUOTE=John Schubert T*A*R*T]

Hal Kelly's Ben Hur was a distinct design, but there was a scaled up Jupiter developed by an old-timer some here will remember named Dub Parker. Kelly drew a set of plans for this larger Jupiter, but I never saw a boat built from them. If the bottom angles were got right, this could have been a very good boat for the time.

Hal Kelly did get a lot of us started in racing. I have often wondered whether Nick Marchetti got his start with a Wetback, because his early A and B Stock hydros are very close to being Wetbacks without the hook in the bottom. If you fix the bottom of a Wetback (and put a sponson fin on it), as I did once, it works as well as a Marchetti. I have also wondered whether Sid-Craft's runabouts of the early '60s owed something to Kelly's late-'50s Foo-Ling and Madcap runabouts, which were his best designs.

If I had an avatar, John, it would have to show me making a bad start.

Just the opposite as the first Sid runabout was built in the late 40's. Hal Kelly's first boat was built either in 1953 or 1954 and was copied from a Sid. Many times on our way home from races, especially when Johnny Wehrle ran the 1st Hornet after getting beat at Devil's Lake with the Sid bathtubs in A & B. The nationals in Devils Lake were in August. I guess Sid was designing the boat during the long trip back to NJ with Johnny & in a week he built it. Johnny raced in A & B runabout at Lock Haven & I think he won both. On the way home my dad, brother, the Wehrle's & the Kelly's stopped at a diner for dinner. Johnny's dad, Wiff, said "where is Kelly"? Found him outside measuring the new Hornet. Nevertheless, Hal was a great designer working for Fawcett publications who published his plans and kind of sponsored his racing. They were also the people that sold the "Paint a player by number" kits. Hal advcertised these kits on the side of his trailer. See picture below

Picture didn't make it so I'll try again.

[John Schubert T*A*R*T]

Not sure what's happening but if it doesn't post this time go to my scrapbook on Skip Hagerman's site in the 53 - 54 section. Just received message that I had previously posted the picture under my pictures from 1953-1957.