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Thread: Liberalism??

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lars Strom View Post
    High taxes and government fees pay for all this stuff.

    Gas is 3-4 times higher, well..the tax on gas.

    High tax on all energy..(Cap and trade)

    25 % VAT..(sales tax)..
    (I have already heard our President said that VAT works in other country's)

    Tax on people you employ..salary is one thing..35-40% extra fee on top of that to the government.

    income tax..50..up to 75/80%..

    Healthcare is run by the government, single payer...
    (There is a Cadillac plan for some people)..

    I think our President is using the Swedish text book..I know what he is going to say before he says it.
    Not because am smarter then the President...but it is an old story he is telling us.

    Sorry to be negative but America do not need this CHANGE..
    It is the wrong road...

    We need to get our own energy, (plenty of oil under American soil)
    Nuclear, clean coal, natural gas and everything else possible..but do not go down the road saving energy..that kills the economy and everybody that don't live in the big cities.
    Low corporate taxes and let people run there own life.
    Don't let the liberals destroy this great country.
    We are all way smarter than that.

    There is only one America in the world..don't turn it in the a losing Europe.
    One more thing..my English is sometimes hard to understand but I think
    you get the point.

    No religion in Sweden anymore..Nobody goes to church


    Your english is fine Mr. Strom. Anybody who has an inkling of intelligence gets your point. Another good post! Thank you again.

    Thomas

  2. #22
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    Default I hope we all see this even the 30%

    You have to carry your card 24-7 to prove you are in the US legal!!!
    That is what the fine print says on the back of the card..

    It's a sad state of affairs that some can't hear, LarsYou have done your self well , i'm proud to read your posts, btw i think it's a prerequisite to no ENGLISH , so why does it have to be posted in every driver license in more than that?
    Richard

  3. #23
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    The immigration problem was caused by every conservatives hero, Ronald Regan with his amnesty program. Google it up and read about it if you don`t remember. So many illegals flooded into our country a short time later, were given amnesty and voting privileges, that they became a factor in our elections. No president since, Bush I, Clinton, Bush II, or Obama would get involved with changing the process, when over 20% of our population is Hispanic. No way we can send all these people back now that the damage has been done. Our President wants to close the borders, and insure no more can get in and let the ones that are here become citizens. Nothing else can be done. It was Bush`s plan also, but he didn`t have the nerve to put it into action. Like Lars mentioned we have plenty of oil for our citizens. Problem is our oil is sold on the open world market, so its price is reflected by the need of "have not " nations. American oil should be used only by Americans. This can happen only by government control of who buys our oil. This is not socialism, its common sense. Let the "have not" nations buy Mid East oil. Problem is, free enterprise works on paper, but for businesses like oil, banking, wall street, that are essential to our lives and economy, federal regulations are needed. Our past president rescinded all these regulations, and we are paying for it now. These industries took advantage of our citizens. This has nothing to do with controlling private business, where competition rules. There is no competition in the above mention industries when they all band together to control supply and demand. That is monopolies and is and has been illegal forever in the USA. Problem is these industries have huge federal lobbies that pay off politicians on both sides of the fence, make the politicians rich, these companies get richer, and the American citizen gets screwed. If controlling these industries and locking our borders is socialism than I`m all for it. Our goverment in nothing at all like any European goverment and never can be. Our goverment does not own any private industries. Americans that are goverment employees are not employed in producing products for sale. It is illegal for our goverment to compete with private industries. Case in point. If any of you racers are also boaters and fishermen you will understand this. Not too many years ago, if you were stranded out in your boat, you could call the Coast Guard and they would tow you home. When I was in the Coast guard in the `60`s, we did this all the time. We even brought gas to commercial fisherman who ran out. Then at some point I can`t remember the exact time private industry got involved in the boating tow business. At this point in time the Coast Guard had to cease helping stranded boaters, becuase it interfered with private businesses. From then on the Coast Guard only assists boaters when threat of loss of life is involved. The goverment never bought, controlled auto industries. They lent them money to get them out of the huge jam they were in. Now their business is improving and they are paying the goverment back. simple as that. Don`t buy into everything you see on cable TV. Don`t by stupid.
    Rich

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    Quote Originally Posted by RTM View Post
    The immigration problem was caused by every conservatives hero, Ronald Regan with his amnesty program. Google it up and read about it if you don`t remember. So many illegals flooded into our country a short time later, were given amnesty and voting privileges, that they became a factor in our elections. No president since, Bush I, Clinton, Bush II, or Obama would get involved with changing the process, when over 20% of our population is Hispanic. No way we can send all these people back now that the damage has been done. Our President wants to close the borders, and insure no more can get in and let the ones that are here become citizens. Nothing else can be done. It was Bush`s plan also, but he didn`t have the nerve to put it into action. Like Lars mentioned we have plenty of oil for our citizens. Problem is our oil is sold on the open world market, so its price is reflected by the need of "have not " nations. American oil should be used only by Americans. This can happen only by government control of who buys our oil. This is not socialism, its common sense. Let the "have not" nations buy Mid East oil. Problem is, free enterprise works on paper, but for businesses like oil, banking, wall street, that are essential to our lives and economy, federal regulations are needed. Our past president rescinded all these regulations, and we are paying for it now. These industries took advantage of our citizens. This has nothing to do with controlling private business, where competition rules. There is no competition in the above mention industries when they all band together to control supply and demand. That is monopolies and is and has been illegal forever in the USA. Problem is these industries have huge federal lobbies that pay off politicians on both sides of the fence, make the politicians rich, these companies get richer, and the American citizen gets screwed. If controlling these industries and locking our borders is socialism than I`m all for it. Our goverment in nothing at all like any European goverment and never can be. Our goverment does not own any private industries. Americans that are goverment employees are not employed in producing products for sale. It is illegal for our goverment to compete with private industries. Case in point. If any of you racers are also boaters and fishermen you will understand this. Not too many years ago, if you were stranded out in your boat, you could call the Coast Guard and they would tow you home. When I was in the Coast guard in the `60`s, we did this all the time. We even brought gas to commercial fisherman who ran out. Then at some point I can`t remember the exact time private industry got involved in the boating tow business. At this point in time the Coast Guard had to cease helping stranded boaters, becuase it interfered with private businesses. From then on the Coast Guard only assists boaters when threat of loss of life is involved. The goverment never bought, controlled auto industries. They lent them money to get them out of the huge jam they were in. Now their business is improving and they are paying the goverment back. simple as that. Don`t buy into everything you see on cable TV. Don`t by stupid.
    Rich
    I do not give credit to liberal babble--most of your points are just that.
    Some have a degree of truth,but you put up to many for me to apply enough effort to have you see the rest of the story. I have a couple of Konny engines to work on today. 2 years ago the Konny's and Peter Rix while in florida gave me a inside reality about Europes Politics and Lars is right.
    (love to get info from the horses mouth and not just media dribble)

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Original Looper 1 View Post
    Understanding that human nature and self interests predominately affect most people, I try to read as many points of view as possible so I can accurately conclude a logical, rational and justifiable reason for the global economic and political realities as they exist.

    I moved from Quincy to FL many years ago to a coastal tourist town. Over the past 8 years many communities, including mine, have been inundated with illegal immigration. With the illegal aliens came drug gangs - 13 different gangs have been ID'd - (so many that our police had to create a separate Mexican gang task force to combat them), violence (armed robberies, gang wars in the streets - an 11 yr old boy got in the crossfire and was killed, murders, home invasions, etc), our taxes have exploded to cover the costs of the increased burdens on our schools, our hospitals, public housing and police forces. AZ is trying to gain control of what has been an uncontrollable problem -- people crossing the border into the US illegally.

    Those that come here illegally seem to have no problems breaking other laws once they get here. They work "under the table" for cash and keep wages down for Americans. In the construction business in FL these days you cannot find a job unless you are an illegal working for a sub-contractor as the sub-contractors don't want to pay decent wages, benefits and workers comp to "legal" workers. It's the United States tax payers that make up the difference between the illegal's low wages and what it costs for them to live in America.

    People, this isn't about race, it's about the very wealthy elite using illegal aliens to destroy what is left of the middle class. Look up: Security and Prosperity Partnership of North America. These elite want to merge the US, Mexico and Canada into one large territory. To do that they have to bring down the standards of the US and Canada to Mexico's. I am not crazy, go read the stories about their project.

    What we are witnessing are the long term results of too many short term self interest decisions.

    While most of us were pursuing our self interests, the establishment elite (both liberal AND conservative) have fundamentally been orchestrating their takeover of our country's financial and political systems. Fighting each other over the terms liberal vs conservative is exactly what THEY want -- for while we are fighting each other, we are further ignoring THEM and their continuous, monumental power grab.

    Follow the money, the political time lines and the fraternal connections. It's all there.


    thanks,

    Paul A Christner
    I can see that the apple did not fall far from the tree--at least in reguards to common sense.
    Not trying to blow up your skirt (any one that knows me know I call it like I see it) First seen Loopers at lake spevy in the early 60"s and what an impression they left. OF was in my opinion the crem de la crem of all time
    in Two Stroke engine design. Have helped build a D loop one time what fun and it ran like a animal also.
    Have been reading you political post for some time,just thought it was time to let you know I'm in complete agreement with you.

    Pat Wright

  6. #26
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    Default Simple

    If you are here in America illegally, you have 90 days to return to your country voluntarily with your family and possessions, and get in line to immigrate legally when your turn comes up....If you fail to take advantage of this free pass for your crime of being here illegally, and we find you, and we will, you will be deported immediately and forever banned from legal entry. If you come back to America after being banned, you will have zero civil rights afforded to citizens, and you will be sentenced to 10 years hard labor in a chain gang type work farm....Then deported. No illegal immigration amnesty, never........No way, no how.......Go home......Staying here will not result in any type citizenship, now or ever....Ray

  7. #27
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    Default Sounds more than fair to me.

    Ray,

    I like your solution. How many times have we heard from the establishment (both left and right) that we are a country of LAWS and that the rule of law shall prevail?

    Your solution is far more generous than Mexico's laws regarding illegal immigrants in THEIR country.

    The only other thing that I would consider as a solution would be if the elite multi-millionaires & billionaires would completely spend down their family fortunes to adopt all of these illegals now residing in our country and then promise to take a vow of poverty for the rest of their lives to serve these impoverished people that they claim to champion so much. Will never happen -- they're all phonies! They always use somebody else's money for their social experients, and that money always comes from working Americans that are fed up and see these people for what they really are. Never forget that we working Americans were forced to bail out Wall Street, they never bailed out us (or themselves).


    thanks,

    Paul A Christner


    ps: Thanks Pat for your nice comments about my dad.

  8. #28
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    Default Actually.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Original Looper 1 View Post
    Your solution is far more generous than Mexico's laws regarding illegal immigrants in THEIR country. thanks,
    Paul A Christner
    ps: Thanks Pat for your nice comments about my dad.
    Actually Paul, Calderon was pinned down by Wolf Blitzer about that during a Post speech interview. He said that Mexico's immigration laws were draconian, (my word, not his), but have been changed in the last year to be more humane..
    He said it is no longer a "crime" to be in Mexico illegally??? And Mexico and Honduras, (or their southern border neighbor, if not Honduras), have opened a dialog towards "comprehensive immigration reform".......Ray

  9. #29
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    I did not see the interview with Blitzer on CNN. I did, however, read part of a transcript of the interview at http://cnsnews.com/news/article/66332 that included the following:

    Wednesday afternoon, after appearing at the White House with President Obama, Calderon appeared on CNN's "The Situation Room" with Wolf Blitzer, where he made the point that illegal immigration is no longer a crime in Mexico, under the 2009 revisions.

    “So if people want to come from Guatemala or Honduras or El Salvador or Nicaragua, they want to just come into Mexico, they can just walk in?,” Blitzer asked.

    “No,” Calderon said. They need to fill out a form and undergo a criminal background check, he said.

    “Do Mexican police go around asking for papers of people they suspect are illegal immigrants?” Blitzer asked.

    “Of course. Of course, in the border, we are asking the people, who are you?” Calderon replied.

    Once foreigners are legally admitted to the country, “what the Mexican police do is, of course, enforce the law,” Calderon said.


    Can people who sneak into Mexico from Central America, for example, get a job? Blitzer asked.

    No, no, Calderon replied. “If – if somebody do that without permission, we send back -- we send back them.”

    “You find them and you send them back?” Blitzer asked.

    “Yes,” Calderon confirmed.
    He admitted that Americans have a “very powerful argument” when they say that Arizona and other border states are only trying to do what Mexico itself does with illegal immigrants – find them and send them back.

    IF THEY FIND ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS IN MEXICO - THEY SEND THEM BACK! It seems to me that Calderon was talking out of both sides of his mouth during that interview.


    It's also interesting that I came across the following story tonight. The web link is http://rense.com/general90/all.htm. Since the story does not appear to be copyrighted, I am posting it here for you all to read because I feel it's very important information for American taxpayers.

    All In Just One Hospital
    5-23-10

    Parkland Memorial Hospital in Dallas , Texas is a fairly famous institution and for a variety of reasons:

    1. John F. Kennedy died there in 1963

    2. Lee Harvey Oswald died there shortly after

    3. Jack Ruby-who killed Oswald, died there a few years later.

    On the flip side, Parkland is also home to the second busiest maternity ward in the country with almost 16,000 new babies arriving each year. (That's almost 44 per day---every day.)

    A recent patient survey indicated that 70 percent of the women who gave birth at Parkland in the first three months of 2006 were illegal immigrants. That's 11,200 anchor babies born every year just in Dallas.

    According to the article, the hospital spent $70.7 million delivering 15,938 babies in 2004 but managed to end up with almost $8 million dollars in surplus funding. Medicaid kicked in $34.5 million, Dallas County taxpayers kicked in $31.3 million and the feds tossed in another $9.5 million.


    The average patient in Parkland in maternity wards is 25 years old, married and giving birth to her second child. She is also an illegal immigrant. By law, pregnant women cannot be denied medical care based on their immigration status or ability to pay.

    OK, fine. That doesn't mean they should receive better care than everyday, middle-class American citizens. But at Parkland Hospital they do. "
    Parkland Memorial Hospital has nine prenatal clinics. NINE.

    The Dallas Morning News article followed a Hispanic woman who was a patient at one of the clinics and pregnant with her third child---her previous two were also born at Parkland . Her first two deliveries were free and the Mexican native was grateful because it would have cost $200 to have them in Mexico. This time, the hospital wants her to pay $10 per visit and $100 for the delivery but she was unsure if she could come up with the money. Not that it matters, the hospital won't turn her away. (I wonder why they even bother asking at this point.)

    "How long has this been going on? What are the long-term effects?

    Well, another subject of the article was born at Parkland in 1986 shortly after her mother entered the US illegally - now she is having her own child there as well. (That's right; she's technically a US citizen.)

    These women receive free prenatal care including medication, nutrition, birthing classes and child care classes. They also get freebies such as car seats, bottles, diapers and formula.

    Most of these things are available to American citizens as well but only for low-income applicants and even then, the red tape involved is almost insurmountable.

    Because these women are illegal immigrants, they do not have to provide any sort of legitimate identification - no proof of income.


    An American citizen would have to provide a social security number which would reveal their annual income - an illegal immigrant need only claim to be poor and the hospital must take them at their word.

    Parkland Hospital offers indigent care to Dallas County residents who earn less than $40,000 per year. (They also have to prove that they did not refuse health coverage at their current job.. Yeah, the 'free' care is not so easy for Americans.)

    There are about 140 patients who received roughly $4 million dollars for un-reimbursed medical care. As it turns out, they did not qualify for free treatment because they resided outside of Dallas County so the hospital is going to sue them!

    Illegal's get it all free! But U.S. citizens who live outside of Dallas County get sued! How stupid is this?

    As if that isn't annoying enough, the illegal immigrant patients are actually complaining about hospital staff not speaking Spanish. In this AP story, the author speaks with a woman who is upset that she had to translate comments from the hospital staff into Spanish for her husband.

    The doctor was trying to explain the situation to the family and the mother was forced to translate for her husband who only spoke Spanish. This was
    apparently a great injustice to her.

    In an attempt to create a Spanish-speaking staff, Parkland Hospital is now providing incentives in the form of extra pay for applicantswho speak Spanish. Additionally, medical students at the University of Texas Southwestern for which Parkland Hospital is the training facility will now have a Spanish language requirement added to their already jammed-packed curriculum. No other school in the country boasts such a ridiculous multi-semester (multicultural) requirement.

    Remember that this is about only ONE hospital in Dallas, Texas. There are many more hospitals across our country that must also deal
    with this.

    Check this for yourself...

    http://www.snopes.com/politics/immigration/parkland.asp
    *************************************************

    I think Mexico should have to give Americans (and other non-citizens) that go to Mexico illegally the same benefits and rights that they want us to give to their citizens that come to our country illegally. Either they give us the same deal or, as far as I am concerned, Congress can stick comprehensive immigration reform where the sun doesn't shine -- in Al Gore's lock box. Their idea of reform is to make a "pathway" for every person living here illegally to become citizens. There are over 7 billion people in the world that live in poverty. Who of that 7 billion are you going to say "no immigration" to when they decide to come here illegally to get on the immigration path? Especially since our borders are practically open to the north and south?

    I think the 4 main things that we need to do as a country are:

    (1) cancel NAFTA and bring back our manufacturing jobs
    (2) the US treasury needs to take back the printing of our sovereign currency - our money should not be controlled by a private international entity, which the Federal Reserve is
    (3) any corporation (including banks, oil companies, health care providers, etc) that is too big to fail is too big to allow to remain a monopoly. You cannot regulate monopolies in business, they have to be broken up.
    (4) access to free national birth control

    I feel the right combination and balance of the above would lead us as a nation to prosperity that we've never realized before.


    thanks,

    Paul A Christner

  10. #30
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    Default Remind me why this is not socialism????

    This is from a column from Arthur Brooks in the WAPO today. Read this first page and tell me again why Obama should not be called a socialist. Especially find the paragraph from his speech at ASU. It is clear from those comments that he feels like the govt. should tell you what you should make and that the free enterprise system is completely foreign to him.

    Google Arthur Brooks Washington Post article, it is a doozy!!!!
    Ray
    I call this a culture war because free enterprise has been integral to American culture from the beginning, and it still lies at the core of our history and character. "A wise and frugal government," Thomas Jefferson declared in his first inaugural address in 1801, "which shall restrain men from injuring one another, shall leave them otherwise free to regulate their own pursuits of industry and improvement, and shall not take from the mouth of labor the bread it has earned. This is the sum of good government." He later warned: "To take from one, because it is thought that his own industry and that of his fathers has acquired too much, in order to spare to others, who, or whose fathers, have not exercised equal industry and skill, is to violate arbitrarily the first principle of association, the guarantee to every one of a free exercise of his industry and the fruits acquired by it." In other words, beware government's economic control, and woe betide the redistributors.

    Now, as then, entrepreneurship can flourish only in a culture where individuals are willing to innovate and exert leadership; where people enjoy the rewards and face the consequences of their decisions; and where we can gamble the security of the status quo for a chance of future success.



    Yet, in his commencement address at Arizona State University on May 13, 2009, President Obama warned against precisely such impulses: "You're taught to chase after all the usual brass rings; you try to be on this "who's who" list or that Top 100 list; you chase after the big money and you figure out how big your corner office is; you worry about whether you have a fancy enough title or a fancy enough car. That's the message that's sent each and every day, or has been in our culture for far too long -- that through material possessions, through a ruthless competition pursued only on your own behalf -- that's how you will measure success." Such ambition, he cautioned, "may lead you to compromise your values and your principles."



    I appreciate the sentiment that money does not buy happiness. But for the president of the United States to actively warn young adults away from economic ambition is remarkable. And he makes clear that he seeks to change our culture.

    The irony is that, by wide margins, Americans support free enterprise. A Gallup poll in January found that 86 percent of Americans have a positive image of "free enterprise," with only 10 percent viewing it negatively. Similarly, in March 2009, the Pew Research Center asked individuals from a broad range of demographic groups: "Generally, do you think people are better off in a free-market economy, even though there may be severe ups and downs from time to time, or don't you think so?" Almost 70 percent of respondents agreed that they are better off in a free-market economy, while only 20 percent disagreed.

    In fact, no matter how the issue is posed, not more than 30 percent of Americans say they believe we would fare better without free markets at the core of our system. When it comes to support for free enterprise, we are essentially a 70-30 nation.

    So here's a puzzle: If we love free enterprise so much, why are the 30 percent who want to change that culture in charge?

    It's not simply because of the election of Obama. As much as Republicans may dislike hearing it, statism had effectively taken hold in Washington long before that.

    The George W. Bush administration began the huge Wall Street and Detroit bailouts, and for years before the economic crisis, the GOP talked about free enterprise while simultaneously expanding the government with borrowed money and increasing the percentage of citizens with no income tax liability.

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