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Thread: Reno National meeting report.

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by jose jr21. View Post
    Don I am not sure where stand alone came from. I believe there was a miss communication with the information getting relayed. APR is not issuing points for there classes at Kankakee. US F1 will be issuing points for 45 and F2.

    Jose
    My bad Jose, should have asked before I sounded off. Thanks for responding so quickly. Much work to be done.

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by f1dreamer9 View Post
    What's this about K3 being a stand alone event? If we eliminate the series awarding points to their drivers I believe this will kill this race. I know this 45 boat won't attend and I can think of a few other that will not attend also. Please go back and re-think this proposal. We have seen a drop off in the number of boats at the National Championships. The Kankakee Boat Club deserves better they have been the host of this race as long as I've been in the sport. There should be an accounting of where the $30,000 in advertised prize money is going. Prize money is paid out a month after the race is completed. We have more officials at this race and it seems to be the most disorganized when it comes to getting the schedule completed in a timely manner. If this is the APBA National Championships what is the organization doing to promote the event? Lets work on making this our showcase event and not allow it to further erode any more than it has already.
    Don Wilson
    Don I wrote Report & on face book. So there can be miss communication. Take everything with a grain of salt. Jose was there and I'm sure when the all the commissioners are home and over there jet lag they will post on here. Bad info was not my intention anymore then talking about Jose nads.LOL
    Dave

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    I see a lot of racers are on here so this is want I came up with feel free to comment. This is what I would vote YES for as a driver. New class F2. Legal engine for F2 SST 200, SST120, F1 Sport. F2 requires all left hand turns to have 3 buoys in a triangle shape. F2 will form a competition comity of current drivers from each engine class to promote an even playing field of all drivers. F2 will race under OPC racing rules only. Series may have there own points systems.
    Dave

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by dave hensel View Post
    Don I wrote Report & on face book. So there can be miss communication. Take everything with a grain of salt. Jose was there and I'm sure when the all the commissioners are home and over there jet lag they will post on here. Bad info was not my intention anymore then talking about Jose nads.LOL
    Dave
    It was my fault should have checked the information out more thoroughly before sounding off. Regarding F2 and I have no dog in this fight, but what SPORT is doing with the class is what needs to be done everywhere. When F1 SPORT is listed it seems they have 120, 200's, and their version F1 SPORT racing together. What we have are 15 - 20 boats on the starting dock. This is what the fans pay to see. They do not want 6 - 10 boat fields. It's all Mercury with one exception and hopefully the Johnson's will get the gremlins worked out. We need to work this out on the race course and make adjustments if there is any advantage to one of the motor configurations. What the fans and promoters want is a lot of boats at their races. For instance, when the series goes to Bay City why not have 120, 200's, F1 SPORT, and Formula 150 under the F2 banner. I believe this would raise boat counts and give the class and opportunity to sort out the differences between the motor configurations. One of the biggest logistical nightmares is boats are scattered throughout the country and travel time are significant for all of us getting to these events. There would probably be more F-150's at Bay City than F1 SPORT boats, but lets get boats to the races.

  5. #15
    Team Member jose jr21.'s Avatar
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    Dave - I have no idea what the right answer is , if anyone of us knew what that was we would of solved it by now. I don't think it hurts to try something different since what we have now isn't working. In regards to the previous comment , any negative comments or complaints are pointless and very aggravating if they are not followed by a proposal or and idea for a solution. Some people put in a lot of work and effort behind the scenes to put on the best possible races and don't deserved to be attacked even if they are wrong. Looks like some constructive thoughts are starting to come out on the thread. We definitely are open to any thoughts!

    Jose
    "Racin Is Livin, Everything Else Is Waitin"

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by jose jr21. View Post
    Dave - I have no idea what the right answer is , if anyone of us knew what that was we would of solved it by now. I don't think it hurts to try something different since what we have now isn't working. In regards to the previous comment , any negative comments or complaints are pointless and very aggravating if they are not followed by a proposal or and idea for a solution. Some people put in a lot of work and effort behind the scenes to put on the best possible races and don't deserved to be attacked even if they are wrong. Looks like some constructive thoughts are starting to come out on the thread. We definitely are open to any thoughts!

    Jose
    Maybe you and I will not see eye to eye on this thing Jose. But let me ask you, is that a bad thing or good thing?
    Dave

  7. #17
    Formula 1, SST45 Lee Motorsports's Avatar
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    I've never driven an "F2" so let me get that out there.

    I have driven 45's and F1 for the last 5 years. I jumped from 45 to F1. This is not ideal and it would have helped me to run F2 for a bit but I jumped up levels when the 120/Opti scuffles started.

    In the 45 class, there is only one engine option. In F1 we have several engine variations available (2.5 efi, Johnson, Opti, 2.4 efi, 2.0 efi, Yamaha) according to the rulebook. I realize not all those compete any longer. What is important is there are two different mindsets between the levels of 45 and F1.

    If you compete in the 45 class, generally everyone is using the same amount of horsepower and you compete under that mindset. The competitive advantage is in setup, props, and experience by the driver.

    In F1, we have some basic limiting rules (efi box, heads, and throttlebody size for the primary 2.5 efi being used). Most everything else is open to modification by engine builders. The broader point is we all don't have the same amount of horsepower. And knowing that, we compete under non-SST rules.

    To me, F2 is stuck in the middle of wanting to have an SST mentality but needing a non-SST rulebook on engines allowed to bring boats to the water. Like said by others on this thread, F2 needs to pick a direction and let the chips fall where they may. Allowing the F1SPORT in as an SST200 engine allows for more competition and more national races as now Pt Neches and Orange could be part of the overall points system for high points. Terry never seems to have a problem in 200 running his 120.

    Again, I have no dog in this fight but I'd like to see F2 become the rulebook class with 200/Opti, 120, 150, 140, & F1 SPORT all be eligible engines. This would require participants to forget about "SST" championships and instead go after "F2" championships. More of an F1 mentality and generally be the class that spawns new members of the F1 class.

    Just my $0.02.

    Steve.
    Follow the Lee Motorsports Racing Team on Facebook at:

    https://www.facebook.com/#!/pages/Le...98881513494791

  8. #18
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    Steve,
    The thing you have to be careful about is only allowing engines that are, by rule, competitive with each other. The future of the F2 class is the Optimax, to allow engines that are obviously stronger and less expensive to compete with the Optimax hurts the transition to that engine. Formula 150 and SST-140 engines can be noticeably stronger than the Optimax and at a lower initial cost. It would have been easier for SPORT to just legalize these engines rather than specify the 2.5 that is currently legal but it would have upset the balance and put the Optimax at a disadvantage. The other important factor is that the technical rules for F1SPORT are a product of that organization and can be adjusted at ANY time to maintain the correct balance. Not picking on anyone here - but if you turn that control over to a commission and a vote of the drivers you no longer have the control that is necessary to maintain the balance. As I have said many times on these forums - it works for us because it is controlled by us and it may not work for others. In short - it must be a dictatorship, not a democracy.

  9. #19
    Team Member jose jr21.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dave hensel View Post
    Maybe you and I will not see eye to eye on this thing Jose. But let me ask you, is that a bad thing or good thing?
    Dave
    not a bad thing
    "Racin Is Livin, Everything Else Is Waitin"

  10. #20
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    Steve,
    What I should have said earlier - The important thing is to allow engine configurations that are competitive with each other without allowing engines of any particular configuration to be obviously superior. The goal is to improve participation. Everyone wants to feel that they can win the race or at least be in the hunt. The F1Sport rules are written so the different engine configurations are very equal. If you allowed an engine like the Formula 150, which is superior, even though you increase the potential pool of drivers you actually end up hurting the participation because certain drivers would not attend because they would not be competitive. The rules for the 2.5 Merc carb engine in F1SPORT is the product of testing and has proven to be an inexpensive and competitive engine. It has been stated many times in this forum that Rinker can win with his SST-120 engine, so I guess that engine is OK even without the mods(heads & tuner) allowed under the Sport rules. The Johnson may be a question mark but it hasn't won a race yet and Sport can change those engine rules at anytime if it becomes necessary. I can tell you that the F1Sport engine rules so far have given us some the best racing I have seen in a long time. It has expanded our potential pool of drivers and allowed larger fields of boats which has allowed Sport to post larger prize and travel packages because the site sponsors are excited about the turnout and the competition on the water and are willing to spend more $$. For us it has been a win-win situation.

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