B Looper

[Gene East]

Reply to Tim and Paul

Tim,
Yes, split cases were pre-looper.

Paul,

You're right about your Dad's hearing. I once had a hearing exam at the county fair. I was asked to recommend people who could benefit from hearing aids (other than myself) I said O.F. Christner. I was told I was not the first to recommend him.

He had ample reason to have hearing loss. Most of us who messed around racing have hearing loss, and who spent more time running those loud motors than Chris?

[mac19f]

This conversation was at the first AOMCI meet at Cypress Gardens sometime in the mid 1990's. I asked the question and you responded that you did not think any were made that way. OF responded that many people did not know it but some engines were originally supplied with Merc crankcases.

[Original Looper 1]

Let's try this one more time...........

Quincy Welding did use Merc front case halves temporarily on the 4 cylinder Loopers that left Quincy Welding, which may be why I think you are confused.

Please refrain from commenting further about what my father said on this issue as he is not here to defend himself.

Seems like kind of a petty issue to keep bringing up.


Paul A Christner

[Aeroliner]

I'm looking for a B looper block to restore one of my engines. If I can't find one I will make the item from a billet of 6061T651. If anyone else needs a "B" looper block let me know. If we get say five in production it will reduce the cost for everyone. Let me know if you would like to get one. My E mail is aerolinerboat@aol.com

Alan

[John (Taylor) Gabrowski]

The one thing that modern 2 stroke engineers in terms of modern tuned pipes (expansion chambers) suggest held back the Flathead engine was the split dual port 180 degress separated exhausts per cylinder. That were great for bells but the horsepower difference would be 20% versus some 50% using a single exhaust ported cylinder within the dimensions of the existing Flathead dimension specs. One pipe would feed one cylinder in this case and really make the expansion chambers work where the use of expansion chambers on the original design like megaphines produced mixed sonic shockwaves coming back that did not optimize what a single port single expansion chamber would have then. The old bell systems really pull through extracting unbelievably well but that is where new technology could have taken over but went south when the Z motors came along doing it instead. In discussing this with vetern racer and engine builder Florida's Elmer Grade around 2001 he was of the impression with his experience that given excellent machining practices and knowing the Merc crankshaft and related products and making the Flathead a billet machined job as opposed to castings the engine and crankshaft and related would have done the job but larger wristpins rods and wrist pin holed flathead pistons would certainly be part of the new mix. The engine though would look the same be it a 2, 4 or 6 save that the expansion chambers would be different in design but would belch different when it came to exhaust noise out of expansion chambers desgined right for the single exhaust port cylinder they would be working with.

Any discussion?

[Mark75H]

I'd say there was no proof of that and I think Frank Volker already contradicted it. I'm pretty sure he said he developed a working looper expansion chamber with water injection, but it was too late for the porting and intake design. Konig's V series was already too far ahead due to better port design.

[John (Taylor) Gabrowski]

All it would take ia a single new or used Flathead block where the exhaust tunnel was machined in, the matching sleve installed, new expansion chamber designed to match the new conditions and your off to the races. From all the measurements I have done using 4 cylinder blocks as measurement models it is all quite doable where lots of room exists on the 30 and 40 cube 4 cylinder engines to getting a bit thin walled at 44 cubes but still doable. The revised configuration fits into existing racing expansion chamber computer formulas nicely producing a different pipe that was developed of the old exhaust port configuration. The only other concern would be to use the new larger wrist pin fractured type big end connecting rods and larger wrist pin holes in the flat top looper pistons to go with the better engineered fractured big end connecting rods. The engine would look the same but I suspect sound a little different in the phased sounds and harmonics of the new configuration. Horsepower would defintely go up some knotches. It definetly could be renasaunce engine and made in America too boot!

[Mark75H]

Huh? I don't follow

[John (Taylor) Gabrowski]

Everyone has different abilities to follow differing trains of thought coupled with theorizations and visualizations to complete the big picture from small amounts of other relevent bits here and there. From all that comes the notion that Flatheads may not have left as early as they did being changes could have kept the lineage going longer, but this is all just wishful speculation with some valid engineering notions behind it just like Tim's 444 projects wondering just how far you can push a Merc 44.

[Aeroliner]

I would like to beleive that if you put a 20-H case on a looper it would be the sorryest running engine you ever saw. Looper crankcases were very tight and a 20-H case would come no where close to the Quincy cases. Some fool might have tried it but I'm sure that a real looper would blow by him. Quincy did make a split case for the 20-H but it surely wasn't a looper. See the photos posted above. Also note that there is no way to align the piston porting of a looper with the standard case. My guess a few folks made display engines that could really never run. I will be putting together a MUMPS quincy shortly with all the right Quincy parts and possible a split case 20-H with the case I have shown.

Alan