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JoS
01-18-2014, 08:18 AM
Hi, anybody here who could help me with pictures of the original 1953 Champion AU/BU?
Or maybe you know someone who still owns an original Champion AU/BU? Thanks a lot!
Jo

Ron Hill
01-18-2014, 08:20 PM
I will look through my old magazines to see if I can find a picture of a Champion Boat...Somewhere on BRF is Danny Morehouse with his Speedy Twin and a Champon "KIT" boat.

http://www.boatracingfacts.com/forums/showthread.php?16132-North-South-Race-at-Friant-Dam-Fresno-California-1955&highlight=Danny+Morehouse This is Johnny Craven's Champion BU with a Champion Hot Rod motor on it, but this is not the "Original" Champion AU-BU Runabout.

JoS
01-19-2014, 03:59 AM
Thanks Ron! First I thought that the Champion (Hot Rod) motors and the Champion hulls were produced in the same company, until I found out that the boats came from Southern California and the motors from the Minnesota / St. Paul area. Is it right that the two manufacturers hadn't anything to do with each other?

Another thing which also astonished me is that no Champion boats can be found in the result lists of the Winnebagoland Marathons. I only found a Champion boat taking fifth place in class AU (in the 1952 or 53 marathon, as far as I remember). First I thought that the big distance to Wisconsin was the reason. But on the other hand the Sid Crafts were manufactured in California as well and many Sid Craft boats ran in Winnebagoland. Do you have an explanation?

Mike Schmidt
01-19-2014, 05:56 AM
Sid Craft and latter Sid Son were all built in New Jersey (on the East Coast). In my 40 + years of racing I have never seen a Champion boat. I have seen hundreds of Sid's. I think Sid just built a bunch more boats.

In the day, they were a very good boat. I won a bunch of races in AOH (250 hydro) and BSH in them.

Michael D-1

John Schubert T*A*R*T
01-19-2014, 07:02 AM
Hi, anybody here who could help me with pictures of the original 1953 Champion AU/BU (not pics of a replica)?
Or maybe you know someone who still owns an original Champion AU/BU? Thanks a lot!
Jo

Go to this site. You'll find the original Champion brochure as well as many other race boats from the 50's racing era, which was great. http://www.pfs-ware.com/50s/50s_page12.htm

JoS
01-19-2014, 03:31 PM
Sid Craft and latter Sid Son were all built in New Jersey (on the East Coast)
Sorry, my mistake... I mixed up Sid Craft and De Silva! So the geographic distance might be an explanation... I also didn't find a mentionable number of De Silvas in the Winnebagoland race results, although they were highly competitive boats. Winnebagoland mainly was a game between Sid Crafts, Speedliners, Switzercrafts and Raveaus.


Go to this site.
Thanks, John, I've already seen this site. What really interests me are photos and some details of the AU/BU utility, especially a rear view of the transom and the construction of the frames.

Ron Hill
01-19-2014, 06:00 PM
See, when "THE DAMN MERCURY" came along, "REAL" racers were burning alcohol. The alcohol burners were called "ALKY RACERS". Most of them, probably 95% hated thos "DAMN MERCURY MOTORS. Alky Racers raced DeSilva boat. Those "DAMN MERCURY" guys raced home made "KIT" boat like Champions.

In 1954, at the DePere, Wisconsin Nationals, there were probably 4 DeSilva boats (Ronnie Loomis's CU, Red Thomas's AU-BU, and Bob Parrish's A-B Hydro and AU-BU...(Loomis ws from Santa Barbara, Red was a Major in the Marine Air Force and Parrish was the son of rich Cotton farmers and oil well owners in Bakersfield. Evreyone else bought cheap boats or built their own.

My dad was the motor inspector at the Winnebagoland Marathon in 1953,54 and 55. I'm surprized there were any DeSilva boats in the Winnebagoland Marathon.

In 1954, the LASA (Los Angeles Speedboat Association) and "Alky Club", voted to "KICK OUT THOSE DAMN MERCURYS" My dad, who was Race Chairman of LASA quit LASA over this vote. No one in our family ever joined LASA after 1954, thought my dad was a ccharter member.

So, FYI, Kit Boats were for the guy with NO MONEY!!!! And owned A Damn Mercury!

DeanFHobart
01-19-2014, 07:30 PM
I think Darrell Sorensen has Champion Runabout plans or kits... csr4c@jps.net

JoS
01-20-2014, 03:24 AM
Thank you, Ron and Dean! I got old Champion plans from a friend of mine, Rod Geraghty in Wisconsin. I'm deeply interested in the construction details and the history. That's why I'm often talking to Rod via Skype, learning as much as possible about vintage outboard racing. It's a great pleasure to get all these first hand information from those people who have experienced the real thing in th 1950s and 60s.

About two years ago I started to organize a boat racing club exclusively for radio controlled replicas of vintage outboard racing boats, scaled down to size 1/5,2. That's why our club is called 152VO ("1/5,2 Vintage Outboard"). We started with 9 guys in August 2012. Meanwhile our club has grown to 680 members with 180 boats in 10 countries. You can see a few of our boats here: http://www.152vo.de/index.php/community/die-152vo-rennboote.html (cottage racers as well as competitive racers of the stock and alky classes). We hold annual meetings and drive closed course races (utility and hydro) as well as marathon (team) races on a quartermile track. Our racing rules are based on the APBA rule book 1953. Meanwhile our vintage outboard racing club has become very popular in Germany, Switzerland, Netherlands, Belgium, France and Austria.

My first model replica which I built fpr the 2012 competition was a tiny little cottage racer, the Atomite, published in "Boat Builder's Handbook", drawn by William D. Jackson and sold as a kit boat by a manufacturer called "Ozarka" in the early 1950s.

http://www.152vo.de/images/stories/lightbox/treffen_2013/091.jpg

My second one for the 2013 competition was a scale replica of the 1951 Switzercraft BU Baby Bullet, which is running awesome. A very fast and stable boat. I took second place in the results, my wife took first place with her Baby Bullet.

http://www.152vo.de/images/stories/lightbox/treffen_2013/004.jpg

http://www.152vo.de/images/stories/lightbox/treffen_2013/031.jpg

Here's a pic of a few of our boats on the last competition in August 2013:

http://www.152vo.de/images/stories/lightbox/treffen_2013/121.jpg

I'm the guy in the green t-shirt to the left. If you're interested you can find more than 100 photos of the 2013 competition here: http://www.152vo.de/index.php/community/die-152vo-events.html#2nd (click on one of the four thumbnail pics on the right to open the gallery).

http://www.152vo.de/images/stories/lightbox/treffen_2013/037.jpg

http://www.152vo.de/images/stories/lightbox/treffen_2013/045.jpg

So I have a cottage racer and a stock BU at the moment. My next boats will be a class B Alky, the Jacoby Flyaway (conventional) from the late 1930s and the 1953 Champion AU/BU which I'll try to finish for the next competition. That's why I'm interested in some construction details of the original Champion boat. If you know someone who has built an original Champion kit boat or still owns a Champion AU/BU please let me know. It's really tricky to get detailed information about these boats after 60 years so every information is highly welcome.

1100r
01-20-2014, 03:59 AM
Very nice work on the boats. Curious what kind of speeds do they reach if you can without letting any secrets out? Now all you need to do is add a rider to VO-46

Very Impressive

Todd

JoS
01-20-2014, 04:56 AM
Todd, thank you. Although our goal is not to reach top speed but scale speed some of the boats are pretty fast. When we started the whole 152VO story we were really astonished how efficient these old hull designs are. The slowest of our models (e.g. the cottage racer utilities) run at velocities around 30-35 km/h (i.e. around 20 mph). The fast ones like Hal Kelly's Foo Ling, the Speedliners or the Switzercrafts come close to 60 km/h (37 mph). A three pointer like the Kelly Jupiter or Wetback is capable to hit the 60 km/h mark.

But if you run that fast the boats don't look "realistic" anymore. That's why we limited the motor revs, propellers and battery voltage in our racing rules. An average 152VO race boat runs something around 40-45 km/h (25-28 mph). If you extrapolate this model speed by it's scale to the speed of a full size hull (25 respectively 28 mph x square root 5.2) our models would run something around 57 - 64 mph. That's still a bit faster than the originals in the mid 1950s (maybe a DSH or F Hydro could beat this speed), but it looks pretty realistic.

A slow one... around 20 mph:

http://www.152vo.de/images/stories/lightbox/mod_atomite/atomite14.jpg

A fast one... running full throttle over the scratch line, around 30 mph:

http://www.152vo.de/images/stories/lightbox/treffen_2013/034.jpg

Our microprocessor controlled, programmable starting clock, based on an original of the 1950s:

http://www.152vo.de/images/stories/lightbox/treffen_2013/009.jpg

John Schubert T*A*R*T
01-20-2014, 05:56 AM
Thank you, Ron and Dean! I got old Champion plans from a friend of mine, Rod Geraghty in Wisconsin. I'm deeply interested in the construction details and the history. That's why I'm often talking to Rod via Skype, learning as much as possible about vintage outboard racing. It's a great pleasure to get all these first hand information from those people who have experienced the real thing in th 1950s and 60s.

About two years ago I started to organize a boat racing club exclusively for radio controlled replicas of vintage outboard racing boats, scaled down to size 1/5,2. That's why our club is called 152VO ("1/5,2 Vintage Outboard"). We started with 9 guys in August 2012. Meanwhile our club has grown to 680 members with 180 boats in 10 countries. You can see a few of our boats here: http://www.152vo.de/index.php/community/die-152vo-rennboote.html (cottage racers as well as competitive racers of the stock and alky classes). We hold annual meetings and drive closed course races (utility and hydro) as well as marathon (team) races on a quartermile track. Our racing rules are based on the APBA rule book 1953. Meanwhile our vintage outboard racing club has become very popular in Germany, Switzerland, Netherlands, Belgium, France and Austria.

My first model replica which I built fpr the 2012 competition was a tiny little cottage racer, the Atomite, published in "Boat Builder's Handbook", drawn by William D. Jackson and sold as a kit boat by a manufacturer called "Ozarka" in the early 1950s.

http://www.152vo.de/images/stories/lightbox/treffen_2013/091.jpg

My second one for the 2013 competition was a scale replica of the 1951 Switzercraft BU Baby Bullet, which is running awesome. A very fast and stable boat. I took second place in the results, my wife took first place with her Baby Bullet.

http://www.152vo.de/images/stories/lightbox/treffen_2013/004.jpg

http://www.152vo.de/images/stories/lightbox/treffen_2013/031.jpg

Here's a pic of a few of our boats on the last competition in August 2013:

http://www.152vo.de/images/stories/lightbox/treffen_2013/121.jpg

I'm the guy in the green t-shirt to the left. If you're interested you can find more than 100 photos of the 2013 competition here: http://www.152vo.de/index.php/community/die-152vo-events.html#2nd (click on one of the four thumbnail pics on the right to open the gallery).

http://www.152vo.de/images/stories/lightbox/treffen_2013/037.jpg

http://www.152vo.de/images/stories/lightbox/treffen_2013/045.jpg

So I have a cottage racer and a stock BU at the moment. My next boats will be a class B Alky, the Jacoby Flyaway (conventional) from the late 1930s and the 1953 Champion AU/BU which I'll try to finish for the next competition. That's why I'm interested in some construction details of the original Champion boat. If you know someone who has built an original Champion kit boat or still owns a Champion AU/BU please let me know. It's really tricky to get detailed information about these boats after 60 years so every information is highly welcome.
Jo,

Did you ever cast up more throttles? You said that you were going to? I started racing Jacoby Hydros. If you go to my scrapbook you'll see plenty of pictures of many Jacoby hydros including mine # 519-J & than 19-J. I also have a model of a 20H that my friend Dave Doyle had made when the guy who made it also made a baby bullet. I would like you to make a Jacoby 3 point for me for the 20H. I would be willing to send the motor to you for scale purposes. BTW the guy that made the motor made a few extra. Perhaps we can do a trade.

JoS
01-20-2014, 06:44 AM
If you go to my scrapbook you'll see plenty of pictures of many Jacoby hydros including mine # 519-J & than 19-J.

John, where can I find your scrapbook? Regarding the throttles and the Jacoby three pointer model I'll write you a PM.

John Schubert T*A*R*T
01-20-2014, 06:56 AM
John, where can I find your scrapbook? Regarding the throttles and the Jacoby three pointer model I'll write you a PM.
http://www.antiqueoutboardmotor.info/Schubert/schubert.html

e-mail me direct at jschubert19j@gmail.com

DeanFHobart
01-20-2014, 01:24 PM
JoS,

Here is info on the Champion Runabouts..... http://www.boatracingr11.com/sorensenmain.htm

Then click on Classic Utility Kits, for pictures and also pictures of construction.

Good Luck,

Dean Hobart..........................

jon66w
01-21-2014, 11:47 AM
56253I had a Champion kit AU/BU that my Dad and I built. This was the day that you could start stock racing building a kit boat and buying a ready to go actual racing motor from a local dealer. It was in the early 50's and was very affordable. We were not going very fast but had lots of fun. I think the fastest I ever saw on my pre popper 20H was 49mph. I don't know if we could ever go back to this as stock fishing boats can go much faster which means that stock outboarding will NEVER be a spectator sport again. I think the only tough part of building it was bending the Mahogany coming strip into a U around the front cockpit. My Dad broke two before he soaked in hot water for a couple hours. The picture below was taken on the Lake Michigan Milwaukee lake front in 1956. Yes we raced on the big lake back then, no fair weather racers back then. When the five minute gun went off, you raced! The boat was reasonbly fast in a straight line but was a handful in the corners. Later I found out this boat was supposed to be flat turned and wouldn't bank turn like every one did on our river courses, no matter how big turn fin I put on. Ah, the inoscence of youth. JON

JoS
01-22-2014, 05:01 AM
Jon, that's a phantastic picture, thank you! From the plans I thought as much that the Champion wouldn't bank turn because of the flat non trip chines which are angeled at only 20.
Could you send me a PM with your email address for some additional questions?

Joe Silvestri 36-S
01-22-2014, 09:54 AM
Cool club and assortment of boats you have. Great Job building them as well.

JoS
02-16-2014, 09:18 PM
We have added new videos of our outboard racing models to our Youtube channel: http://www.youtube.com/user/152VO

Please subscribe to our channel - much more footage followig soon!

Ron Hill
02-16-2014, 09:29 PM
All these scale models are ELECTRIC motors????

JoS
02-16-2014, 09:57 PM
Yes, all of them. I think most members of our club would like to drive "real" nitro engines (especially I would), but due to the legal situation in Germany (and other european countries) we are not allowed to drive gas model engines on german lakes and ponds. :(

On the other hand fast electrics are much more uncomplicated and meanwhile you get distinctly more power and much higher rpm from a brushless motor then from a nitro engine. Weight is another reason: an outboard leg with 3.5 cc engine weights around 700-800 grams without fuel, an electric outboarder (including batteries!) does not exceed 400-500 grams. Last not least the torque is higher on a brushless motor, especially on low rpm. So the advantages are on the electric side... but the sound isn't.

Ron Hill
02-16-2014, 11:57 PM
When my kids were small and driving little boats, I drilled some hole in the tower so they made noise. The new motors (1984) were so quiet, you could yell at the ids driving the boats.

I think it is great to have the electric boats working so well.....(Maybe sesign a siren that is diven by water)...

I did notice the boats handled very well. What RPM motors? ow long do the batteries last? What are the batteries made of?

JoS
02-17-2014, 10:17 AM
I did notice the boats handled very well. What RPM motors? How long do the batteries last? What are the batteries made of?
Ron, you can find the detailed specs of each boat (written in English) under the respective video on Youtube -> http://www.youtube.com/user/152VO

The motors are running at about 30,000 rpm idling cycle which is about 25,000 under load. The batteries are lithium polymers (lipo) and have to last at least 15 laps on a cloused course of 18 * 78 meters. This is a total distance of 2,650 meters = 1,65 miles. The top speed of the boats is 25 - 37 mph, the resulting race time is about 5 minutes. We're also driving team marathons with teams of three or four boats and a total distance of 96 laps = 16.95 km = 10.6 miles. In marathons each boat is changed at least one time.